Practice: Varsity and JV together

[arbond]

Our situation:

- 5 coaches for HS football

- JV players will play on Mondays - playing the school that the Varsity played on the previous Friday

- We want to practice together for most of the week - especially preseason - so that varsity and JV players can be coached together by specific position coaches - in other words - all the QB's will be together with a QB coach for Indy practice, etc.

My question: When doing "team" offense, or team defense - do you recommend running the varsity offense against the JV defense, and vice versa?

or....having coaches in the middle of the field - and varsity offense against 2nd team varisty defense going one way - with JV offense going against JV 2nd team defense going the other way on the field?

If it is the first scenario......how do you deal with advanced varsity guys playing against less developed JV players?

[playsmart]

Jan 13, 2011 15:48:23 GMT -6 arbond said:

Our situation:

- 5 coaches for HS football

- JV players will play on Mondays - playing the school that the Varsity played on the previous Friday

- We want to practice together for most of the week - especially preseason - so that varsity and JV players can be coached together by specific position coaches - in other words - all the QB's will be together with a QB coach for Indy practice, etc.

My question: When doing "team" offense, or team defense - do you recommend running the varsity offense against the JV defense, and vice versa?

or....having coaches in the middle of the field - and varsity offense against 2nd team varisty defense going one way - with JV offense going against JV 2nd team defense going the other way on the field?

If it is the first scenario......how do you deal with advanced varsity guys playing against less developed JV players?

This is what our varsity team did this past year. varsity had their team O and D time with just the guys that where going to play or rotation. The the best of the rest was the scout team.

At the end of practice, the varsity team would go and condition or run through group stuff like 2 min drill, pursuit, etc and the the JV guys would practice against each other (our O against our D). Usually one or two coaches were with the varsity guys and the rest with the JV.

[scottc]

We had to do this last year. We had some JV guys that were backups etc for us on Friday nights and some started. WE would do our indy together and would try to get the best scout O or D we could get on the other side. I am going to look at changing this up some to get the JVer more reps for their own sakes. The JV would get a lot of their team work on Wed and Thurs. Would also like to hear thoughts on others that are in this boat.

[coachplaa]

You can obviously practice all of the fundamental drills together, but for team, what if you had the Varsity offense going east vs a varsity scout team, and the JV offense going west vs a jv scout team. Call the same play in the huddle, have the varsity run the play while the jv offense watches from their adjacent huddle, and then have the jv go run the same play. JV players could watch the varsity kids, and then go do it themselves. Just an idea...

[arbond]

Jan 13, 2011 18:17:47 GMT -6 coachplaa said:

You can obviously practice all of the fundamental drills together, but for team, what if you had the Varsity offense going east vs a varsity scout team, and the JV offense going west vs a jv scout team. Call the same play in the huddle, have the varsity run the play while the jv offense watches from their adjacent huddle, and then have the jv go run the same play. JV players could watch the varsity kids, and then go do it themselves. Just an idea...

That is what i was referring to in the second option in the original post. I think that is what we are going to do.

[bighit65]

We would have our starting d vs. the best varsity scout offense we could put together, as well as the starting jv offense. Varsity scout goes then jv does. gets your starters more reps as well as good competition for the jv. JV gets less out of this IMO.

[jgordon1]

Last year all the JV and Varsity practiced together Frosh practiced separate...about 105 kids...we have 9 total coaches....When it came time for team..we did it two ways..The first way was varsity vs the best of the best..when we did it this way we sent the JV's to scrimmage the frosh..The Jv's had their hands full our frosh were pretty good..the second way we did it was just using a regular scout team...when we did this we ended up w/ abou 20 kids on the side doing nothing, which lead to distractions

[Coach Bennett]

Running that many more kids through each Indy period, are your periods longer than if your teams practiced separately?

Assuming you warm up together, do you put jv captains out front with your varsity guys?

[bluboy]

We have about 140 kids grades 9-12. There are 2 paid frosh coaches and one frosh volunteer; as well as 5 paid varsity coaches. Everyone warmed-up together. During kick periods, the frosh worked at one of the field while the varsity worked at the other end(JV's service the varsity).During individual the frosh coaches take the frosh through the same drills as the varsity counterparts, but the frosh work amongst themselves (frosh not going against big dogs).
During combo run/pass the frosh go with their coaches; the JV's go with one coach who is the JV coach; all while the varsity guys are with the varsity coaches. During team periods the varsity coaches are with the varsity, but the JV coach will take JV's (any soph or junior not on at least 2nd team) and go against the frosh.
This has really helped us in that we now have 4 coaches with the JV's/frosh. We have seen a marked improvement in our younger kids in both skills and football smarts.

[blb]

We have Varsity, JV, Freshman teams (assuming numbers are adequate). Three paid Varsity coaches including header, two each JV and Freshman. JVs and Freshmen play Thursday nights.

I do not like practicing JVs (Sophomores) with Varsity. Besides the obvious physical match-up concerns, either the Varsity kids get fewer "reps" or practice must be longer and go slower.

I don't want to spend time coaching kids who will not be playing for me Friday night.

And our JV coaches like having autonomy with "their" team.

Sorry, arbond - I know that doesn't answer your question.

[arbond]

Jan 16, 2011 9:39:53 GMT -6 blb said:

We have Varsity, JV, Freshman teams (assuming numbers are adequate). Three paid Varsity coaches including header, two each JV and Freshman. JVs and Freshmen play Thursday nights.

I do not like practicing JVs (Sophomores) with Varsity. Besides the obvious physical match-up concerns, either the Varsity kids get fewer "reps" or practice must be longer and go slower.

I don't want to spend time coaching kids who will not be playing for me Friday night.

And our JV coaches like having autonomy with "their" team.

Sorry, arbond - I know that doesn't answer your question.

Actually, hearing your thoughts is valuable too - thanks!

[shields]

We were in a similar situation last year with six coaches total....3 offense and 3 defense. During INDY, the Varsity went defense while the JV went offense and vice versa. During team, the varsity took a few reps then the JV. It was not the most ideal situation so we are looking for a possible change next season. Keep the ideas roling. Thanks.

[hsrose]

For us the Frosh play on Thursday and the JV and varsity play on Friday. The Frosh are usually off on their own, doing their own thing. Practicing the JV and varsity together usually ends up with the JV holding bags for the varsity or running scout. Only by separating the teams can each work on what they need with appropriate competitive level. I suppose the same situation could apply if the JV and Frosh practiced together.

One concept I've played with is platooning the coaches. Treat the JV and varsity as platoons of the same team. Offensive coaches have the varsity today, the defensive coaches have the JV. Tomorrow, varsity does D, JV does offense. This requires that the majority of the coaches will be coaching both the JV and varsity teams during the games. The coordinators would be in charge of "their" day - JV OC in charge of drills, etc. when the JV have offense, varsity DC in charge when varsity doing defense. It would probably help the coaches by letting/forcing them work on their areas until they are very proficient at their skills.

I haven't implemented this because I'm the JV guy. Might try it with the Frosh this year.

[ajreaper]

Another alternative is to do all your Indy/fundy stuff together then send the JV off for group and team. There is value in this as your young players get coached up doing the same indy/fundy stuff your varsity kids do, same buzz words, same coaching points emphasized etc. JV kids also have the advantage of great role models to learn what a drill should look like and the effort in which it should be done. You can add a bit more time to each period to allow for the same number of reps you'd normally expect to get- I believe there is a lot of value in at least doing indy/fundy together.

[coachwoodall]

Where I am at now, 14 coaches for Varsity, JV, 9th. Practice varsity and JV together, 9th seperate (4 of the coaches). Since kids can play 8 quarters, we just let all the V/JV work together and the JV are basically the scout teams when we go team.

We keep the verbage the same. The one period where the JV get real team time is when the varsity is watching film on Tuesday, they scrimmage the 9th grade. All the coaches are at the scrimmage except the OC/DC.

At another stop, we didn't have the 8 quarter rule, so the V/JV were seperate teams. We had 6 coaches. We would start practice with them mixed in together while we did warm ups/drills/indy/group work, when we went to the team periods, we would split and half the coaches (the 'JV' coaches) would take the JV to one end to do team work, and the varsity (and varsity coaches) did the same on the other end.

[Coach Bennett]

Jan 18, 2011 12:33:01 GMT -6 ajreaper said:

Another alternative is to do all your Indy/fundy stuff together then send the JV off for group and team. There is value in this as your young players get coached up doing the same indy/fundy stuff your varsity kids do, same buzz words, same coaching points emphasized etc. JV kids also have the advantage of great role models to learn what a drill should look like and the effort in which it should be done. You can add a bit more time to each period to allow for the same number of reps you'd normally expect to get- I believe there is a lot of value in at least doing indy/fundy together.

I like the consistency of this approach.

Would you do indy for both D and O and then break or do one, go team on their own, and then come back for indy on the other side of the ball?

[freezeoption]

here is what I have done and has worked well, when practicing offense I had my first team o go against my best d, as much first teamers as I could, ran a play, then had my jv offense run the play right after against that d, just kept the cycle going getting in as much I could in the same time, then would do the same on d, had a scout o, had first team d then jv d, I also worked into that time backups in varsity and jv work in there groups, you can get a lot done in that fashion and have your backups ready to switch in when it came time, at another school we did it another way that I liked but you got to have some numbers, we had three groups, varsity, jv, frosh, we took the three first team offenses, we had three defenses, the three groups would each be assigned to run just three plays against that defense, like my station would have power and counter and maybe another play, when whatever age group came to my station we did nothing but run that play, after 10 min or so would rotate, so I might start with frosh, then the jv would rotate to me and they would go to the other station, our 9 base running plays got covered, the segment took about 30 min, everybody got a lot of work, you can do this with six coaches, two in each group, one covering defense other covering offense

[dubber]

How many players?

[mholst40]

arbond

We did this for the first time this season. Our program philosophy is that we will sacrifice winning at the lower levels in exchange for learning fundamentals and scheme as well as playing more players to keep more kids involved.

We have nine coaches who coach Varsity and JV. Our JV Head Coach is the only guy dedicated to JV only, but he also helps out Varsity on game day. Our LB coach acts as our JV Defensive Coordinator and breaks for group and team time on JV defensive days to go work with them. We platoon a fair amount of players at the Varsity level, so we practice with an emphasis on offense or defense and the JV does the opposite so that we can share coaches. When we get to group or team time, our coaches stay with their level.

Time will tell whether or not this was effective, but I liked working with the JV players and seeing them everyday. I also will like the smooth transition that will occur next year, not only in scheme and fundamentals, but in practice routines.

[jackedup]

Dec 8, 2015 9:32:46 GMT -6 mholst40 said:

arbond

We did this for the first time this season. Our program philosophy is that we will sacrifice winning at the lower levels in exchange for learning fundamentals and scheme as well as playing more players to keep more kids involved.

We have nine coaches who coach Varsity and JV. Our JV Head Coach is the only guy dedicated to JV only, but he also helps out Varsity on game day. Our LB coach acts as our JV Defensive Coordinator and breaks for group and team time on JV defensive days to go work with them. We platoon a fair amount of players at the Varsity level, so we practice with an emphasis on offense or defense and the JV does the opposite so that we can share coaches. When we get to group or team time, our coaches stay with their level.

Time will tell whether or not this was effective, but I liked working with the JV players and seeing them everyday. I also will like the smooth transition that will occur next year, not only in scheme and fundamentals, but in practice routines.

I think that smooth transition is the biggest advantage of doing it that way. 


I have 10 coaches for Varsity & JV and am looking at doing it this way. My only problem is that JV play on Wednesdays. I find the middle of the week being the biggest issue. What do you think? 

[mholst40]

jackedup

For me it would depend on how you staff your JV. Do they play at the same time you practice at the varsity level? Do JV players get to play varsity the same week?

Here, JV players either play JV or Varsity, not both and JV plays before the Varsity games on Friday nights.

[funkfriss]

Preseason for sure we go as much JV/V together as we can. We have our coaches platoon and give each kid a primary and secondary position (mostly one offense, one defense). When it comes to team time we will run two offensive huddles, 1 Varsity primary players, 1 JV primary players, and two defenses, again 1 Varsity primary, 1 JV primary. Varsity runs 3 plays vs. Varsity then JV goes for 3 plays vs. JV Defense. I like this because it allows us to run 3 quick plays (usually in a minute) and then coach the kids up while the other group runs 3 plays. This takes away from the scenario when we will stop a team segment to explain to 1 kid what he is doing wrong while everybody else stands around. After about 7 minutes (roughly 15 minutes and 21 plays per team) we switch and have the secondaries go for 7 rounds.

Advantages
1. Each coach watches and critiques his position in a team segment (both JV and V)
2. More time with your position coach
3. JV kids watch and learn from V
4. JV kids like performing well in front of V kids
5. Younger kids learn common lingo and expectations
6. Coaching is done when teams are resting, not in the middle of the drill

Disadvantage
1. Not as many reps as splitting up JV and Varsity

[freezeoption]

Dec 7, 2015 21:13:08 GMT -6 dubber said:

How many players?

you have your 11 for each frosh, jv and varsity, we usually had 11 on d in the station dealing with option, mid, inside and outside, from there you could get by with your inside stations and ctr stations with 8 at each station on defense, would be better with 11 but you could get by with the inside of the defense

[jackedup]

Dec 8, 2015 10:50:22 GMT -6 funkfriss said:

Preseason for sure we go as much JV/V together as we can. We have our coaches platoon and give each kid a primary and secondary position (mostly one offense, one defense). When it comes to team time we will run two offensive huddles, 1 Varsity primary players, 1 JV primary players, and two defenses, again 1 Varsity primary, 1 JV primary. Varsity runs 3 plays vs. Varsity then JV goes for 3 plays vs. JV Defense. I like this because it allows us to run 3 quick plays (usually in a minute) and then coach the kids up while the other group runs 3 plays. This takes away from the scenario when we will stop a team segment to explain to 1 kid what he is doing wrong while everybody else stands around. After about 7 minutes (roughly 15 minutes and 21 plays per team) we switch and have the secondaries go for 7 rounds.

Advantages
1. Each coach watches and critiques his position in a team segment (both JV and V)
2. More time with your position coach
3. JV kids watch and learn from V
4. JV kids like performing well in front of V kids
5. Younger kids learn common lingo and expectations
6. Coaching is done when teams are resting, not in the middle of the drill

Disadvantage
1. Not as many reps as splitting up JV and Varsity

In the preseason I don't see this as being a bad way of doing it. But I still think you might be missing reps. Do you use this during the season as well? 

[jackedup]

For those who have 2 separate offensive groups go against 1 scout defense (or vice versa), who makes up your JV? I like that idea but my JV is made up of mostly 9th and the weaker 10th graders. I'm not sure I'll have a lot of support for doing it this way.

[funkfriss]

Dec 9, 2015 7:07:36 GMT -6 jackedup said:

Dec 8, 2015 10:50:22 GMT -6 funkfriss said:

Preseason for sure we go as much JV/V together as we can. We have our coaches platoon and give each kid a primary and secondary position (mostly one offense, one defense). When it comes to team time we will run two offensive huddles, 1 Varsity primary players, 1 JV primary players, and two defenses, again 1 Varsity primary, 1 JV primary. Varsity runs 3 plays vs. Varsity then JV goes for 3 plays vs. JV Defense. I like this because it allows us to run 3 quick plays (usually in a minute) and then coach the kids up while the other group runs 3 plays. This takes away from the scenario when we will stop a team segment to explain to 1 kid what he is doing wrong while everybody else stands around. After about 7 minutes (roughly 15 minutes and 21 plays per team) we switch and have the secondaries go for 7 rounds.

Advantages
1. Each coach watches and critiques his position in a team segment (both JV and V)
2. More time with your position coach
3. JV kids watch and learn from V
4. JV kids like performing well in front of V kids
5. Younger kids learn common lingo and expectations
6. Coaching is done when teams are resting, not in the middle of the drill

Disadvantage
1. Not as many reps as splitting up JV and Varsity

In the preseason I don't see this as being a bad way of doing it. But I still think you might be missing reps. Do you use this during the season as well? 

Definitely missing reps, but in the preseason I don't mind as we are more in teaching mode.  The way we get around this is by having a "Team Fly" period where we will throw 10 balls out on the field about 5 yards apart and vary hashes or middle.  QB gets the signal, calls the formation/play (how we run our no-huddle) and we go up and down the field twice.  That gives us 40 reps in about 8 minutes.  

You can work out the kinks during this period (formation alignment, blocking path, steps, routes, etc.) by verbalizing on the fly.  I tell the players to go fast and that we're not going to be critical of mistakes during this period, but we will correct them.  I'm always cognizant of errors and come back to the same formation/play a couple plays later to make sure we're correcting it on the fly.

[td4tc]

Tried this for two years. Not easy. Admire you for trying. Worst thing a HS program can do is give up the JV program.

We did team period as you suggest with both Offences going away from centre field with OC in the middle calling plays and alternating. If the offences are similar as they should be the JV's get a "visual rep" from watching the V team run the play, then they go.
Other way for offences is to go down the field with V's going first and moving ahead 20 and the JV's run the same play behind them. This is better vs air obviously. Same visual reps thing applies.

For Indi's we just mixed em up like you did and made sure the match ups were even.

[coachwoodall]

Make personnel groupings based for varsity, JV, freshmen, etc.... Call them A, B, C; 1, 2, 3; Black, White, Red, etc.... and make sure each kid knows his spot

Practice plan your periods, segments to work each group; then just call which group is 'hot' as you progress through each period.

Planning is the crucial element