Two-A-Days, Are they still beneficial?

[TheFOotballCoach]

When me and the head coach sat down to make the August calendar, I was able to convince him that we should not do two-a-days this year. My reasoning was that hopefully, it will keep us fresh down the stretch when it's time to make a playoff run. (Coach Pop of the Spurs did the same thing during the season last year for a prime time game against the Heat, resting his star players, hoping to keep them fresh, he unfortunately was fined).

I also pointed out that we have a talented, mostly veteran team, and that we may be better served in the long run by not going through the grueling two-a-days. 

In my state, we do have the ability to do two-a-days, but it comes with the 2-1-2 practice format. We also are allowed to pretty much do whatever we want in the Summer, as long as we aren't using pads and football equipment (blocking sleds, dummies, etc).

I guess my questions are, do you still use two-a-days? Do you think they are/are not beneficial? Reasoning?

[coach2013]

If its all review and your guys are already in shape from working out- I agree, law of diminishing returns.

[jg78]

Jul 23, 2014 17:10:42 GMT -6 TheFOotballCoach said:

When me and the head coach sat down to make the August calendar, I was able to convince him that we should not do two-a-days this year. My reasoning was that hopefully, it will keep us fresh down the stretch when it's time to make a playoff run. (Coach Pop of the Spurs did the same thing during the season last year for a prime time game against the Heat, resting his star players, hoping to keep them fresh, he unfortunately was fined).

I also pointed out that we have a talented, mostly veteran team, and that we may be better served in the long run by not going through the grueling two-a-days. 

In my state, we do have the ability to do two-a-days, but it comes with the 2-1-2 practice format. We also are allowed to pretty much do whatever we want in the Summer, as long as we aren't using pads and football equipment (blocking sleds, dummies, etc).

I guess my questions are, do you still use two-a-days? Do you think they are/are not beneficial? Reasoning?

My approach is to do everything thoroughly but take no longer than necessary to do it. I have never been one to put in more time just for the sake of doing so. If you feel good about your team's overall preparation and don't feel like it's necessary to have two-a-days, then I wouldn't have them.

[coachbdud]

We no longer do them

We have spring ball
Practice all summer
Have a team camp
7on7 tourneys

2 practices a day aren't necessary

The craziest we will get is to have an early practice and review practice film ... Then BBq the kids lunch
Take a break
And have a practice...
If you can't the film as a practice then that's as close to doubles as we will get now

If we showed up in August then maybe doubles would be more meaningful

It's like studying for your final exam... If you do nothing you gotta cram and pull an all nighter, of you've been studying and taking notes... You don't have to go crazy preparing right before the exam because you know the content

[fantom]

We feel that we need 2-a-days. We don't platoon so this ensures that we have time to get everything in. Summer workouts can't be mandatory here so we cam't be sure that everybody will be there until actual practice starts. If we were a 100% platoon team maybe we'd stop doing 2-a-days but we're sticking with them for now.

[fantom]

Jul 23, 2014 17:10:42 GMT -6 TheFOotballCoach said:

(Coach Pop of the Spurs did the same thing during the season last year for a prime time game against the Heat, resting his star players, hoping to keep them fresh, he unfortunately was fined).

The Heat also rested Wade during the season. 

[joker31]

We will be doing 2-a-days, but pulled back a bit this year during the summer. This is partially because this is an experienced group with some talent, but also because we've peaked early the last few years.

Last year we participated in 2 Team Camps (our own which we run as a fundraiser, and another one with better competition), this year we only partially participated in our own.

We also dialed back on the amount of hours we're with the kids this summer. I run the summer strength/agility/conditioning program and am with them for 4 hours a week, but these are a very difficult 4 hours... The kids are in great shape already. The other 2 hours are spent on their own lifting heavy weights at a local gym (lead by team leaders).

We have a total of six 2-a-day sessions over 2 weeks, partially because we will spend our last week in Texas for a week-long trip plus game. We will have film or weights for 45 mins, then have two 1.5 hour practices with a 30 minute break inbetween.

I'd even limit the 2-a-day sessions, but we have not touched special teams and need to get polished with our schemes there.

[bluedevils10]

Hey guys,
I started a thread on time for 2-a-days and based on what i have seen and heard from other coaches we went to more of a 2-1-2 type. Mon-Wed-Fri 2 practices Tues Thurs 1 3 hr session and then 90 min break then a conditioning session centered around weight lifting.

[powerfootball71]

I would have zero problem not doing two a days. The only benefit i see is out state has a day you start official practice and you have a minimum number of days you must have in helmets before you go full pads then a minimum number of days in full pads before your first game. Two a days Basicly give you some wiggle room incase a kid misses a practice so he can still be good to go week 1.

[spreadpowero]

We have been doing two a days for just the first 4 days for the last 5 years. We have made playoffs each year, so we have no intention of making any changes. The added time allows us to get in more reps and to see more players in action. With a 40-50 man roster every year, we just feel we need those reps to help us evaluate what we have.

[Inthesticks]

It seems that if we cut down on two-a-days, we can keep some border line kids that too much practice pushes them away. Unfortunately, we need some of those border line kids that like football, but don't love it. Giving them the afternoon and evening to do what they want with in the final weeks of summer vacation is huge.

[Deleted]

Our state has restricted them to a 2-1-2 format this year, but I haven't been part of a team that did 2 a days since my senior year of HS.

We're going to go 3 hours a day once we give out pads next week, which will include 30 min for lifting/conditioning. That's as close as we'll get.

We could use the extra time, but attendance has been down by 1/3 when we have morning practices and our HC has responsibilities during the day.

I don't personally know of a single coach who dropped two a days who has regretted it.

[coachsant]

to me 2 a days are necessary---you need to be doing the fundamentals for each position on o and d each day during camp---for a month---then when the season starts you get them once a week--if you dont do 2 a days I do not think you will be able to do this daily---unless you extend the one practice by an hour or 2--isnt that the same thing though?  

[macdiiddy]

We are only going to have 5 two a days this year. With new state laws in place and our school starting earlier then most this is the maximum amount of 2 a days we can have.

Personally I would hate to lose 2 a days (and hate the restrictions we are being put into). It isn't just for the varsity, it allows you to spend more time getting the JV and freshman up to snuff. Valuable reps with live tackling can be coached up and made better, something you don't always have the luxury of doing in season. In addition, 2 a days is when you can take more time explaining special teams and rep the hell out of the technique used in that.

Im of the belief that you can never be good enough in your technique. The more reps the better.

With all that being said, there is something to be said about not running the kids into the ground so they are dead by the time playoff hits. I think this is more mental then anything else. I would rather cut down on the amount of summer conditioning sessions then lose a 2 a day padded practice.

[Deleted]

Jul 25, 2014 21:08:10 GMT -6 coachsant said:

to me 2 a days are necessary---you need to be doing the fundamentals for each position on o and d each day during camp---for a month---then when the season starts you get them once a week--if you dont do 2 a days I do not think you will be able to do this daily---unless you extend the one practice by an hour or 2--isnt that the same thing though?

What do your practice schedules look like during the season?

We don't two platoon and will spend about an hour a day on each side of the ball during the week with 2.5 hour practices each day.

I should be able to get 30-40 min. a day on each side of the ball to work those fundamentals during indie time and keep them crisp since the linemen aren't involved in as many group periods or special teams.

I understand longer practices in the summer to teach and hone those skills, but I'm not sure that 2 a days are necessary to accomplish that goal.

[fcboiler87]

Our school starts so early that our state restrictions do not allow us to start 2 a days in time. Therefore, we do not have time to do them. That is fine with me, as the school calendar has affected the teams I've coached for the past four years. I really don't see the need for them if you have been efficient with your time throughout spring (if you have it) and summer. We start school next week and we can't even begin practice with a football, we are only allowed to condition.

Heck this summer we really didn't go a whole lot and though we may not be as far along as other teams with install, we are at a good point at the kids are fresh and ready to go. I've been at places where it seems kids have been burned out by the time we hit game 3 because of how much off season stuff we have done. We only have gone 3 days a week all summer with 2 of them being lifting and one being football oriented. Plus we did 2 7 on 7s. Pretty mild summer but these kids are ready to go.

[blb]

We need Two-a-days for similar reasons to fantom.

We only have nine days (five in pads) before outside scrimmage, then five days until first game.

We normally do Offense in AM, Defense in PM. But state has now restricted us to one "collision" practice per day, so we're going to have to adjust a little when in full pads.

[bruinfb]

We still do two-a-days.  We still think they are necessary to spend the appropriate time teaching fundamentals.  Blocking, Block Destruction, and Tackling are not skills that all of our players have when they come in in August.  These skills take time and reps to learn.  Just the way we like to do it, I can see the value in not having them.

[gibbs72]

We've gone to more of 1 & 1/2 - a - days. We have 3 days of non pad/ no contact days to start the season. We come in @ 6 am those days and do 90 minutes: stretch/ 60 min of special teams drills + install/ 10 play team O script. Then, a "regular" practice for 2.5 hr @ 3:30. Works great because we are not using valuable padded time in the preseason doing ST (or O & D) walk throughs on the field.

[blb]

FWIW with new restrictions on "collision" practices and our numbers (probably going to be low 20s) I did look at doing one three-hour practice when we put pads on.

Decided not to for now because I think three hours is too long, and we would have to cut at least one Specialty period, one Kicking Game period, and one Warm-Up period which in the past we did Pursuit Drill, Interception Drill, Scoop 'n Score, Block That Kick or some such before PM Defensive practice.

But am going to keep it in back of my mind for next year if I decide to return, after I see how this new regimen works out.

[coachsant]

Jul 26, 2014 0:23:00 GMT -6 @coacharnold said:

Jul 25, 2014 21:08:10 GMT -6 coachsant said:

to me 2 a days are necessary---you need to be doing the fundamentals for each position on o and d each day during camp---for a month---then when the season starts you get them once a week--if you dont do 2 a days I do not think you will be able to do this daily---unless you extend the one practice by an hour or 2--isnt that the same thing though?  

What do your practice schedules look like during the season?

We don't two platoon and will spend about an hour on each side of the ball during the week.  I should be able to get 30-40 min. a day to work those fundamentals during indie time and keep them crisp since the linemen aren't involved in as many group periods or special teams.

we have players go both ways as I think most high schools do....I am very big on doing the same things drill wise/fundamentals every day over and over again.  That month during camp is essential to me.  You get both o and d skills every single day.  If you can do that without 2 a days I would like to know how?  Other than making one practice super long--plus there is also some brotherhood built amongst the coaching staff and players during 2 a days.  Most kids eat together in between sessions and the same with the coaching staff.   Nothing feels better than walking off the field after a nice long 2 a day !!!

[freezeoption]

our state took away two a days, get 3 hours of practice, then 1 hour of film study/break, then one hour of weights or walk through

[Deleted]

Jul 26, 2014 8:40:54 GMT -6 coachsant said:

Jul 26, 2014 0:23:00 GMT -6 @coacharnold said:

What do your practice schedules look like during the season?

We don't two platoon and will spend about an hour on each side of the ball during the week.  I should be able to get 30-40 min. a day to work those fundamentals during indie time and keep them crisp since the linemen aren't involved in as many group periods or special teams.

we have players go both ways as I think most high schools do....I am very big on doing the same things drill wise/fundamentals every day over and over again.  That month during camp is essential to me.  You get both o and d skills every single day.  If you can do that without 2 a days I would like to know how?  Other than making one practice super long--plus there is also some brotherhood built amongst the coaching staff and players during 2 a days.  Most kids eat together in between sessions and the same with the coaching staff.   Nothing feels better than walking off the field after a nice long 2 a day !!!

So do you specialize and do one day of offense and only one day of defense during the season with no work whatsoever on the other side of the ball?

It's possible to train those skills by breaking down what you really need to get done, then devoting at least 30 min. per day to individual or group drills on each side of the ball (do 30 min. of fundamental offense on a defensive day; 30 min of tackling, pursuit, and defensive basics on a defensive day, etc.), as well as 20 min. to special teams. Have your scout team put together beforehand, drills set up during warmup, etc.

The other 70-100 min of a 2-2.5 hour practice can be spent however you need without making practice "super long." Use football specific things like pursuit drills, kickoff coverage drills, punt coverage, catch and score from 40 yards out,, etc. to build in the conditioning so you don't need to waste time having them run. Keep your water breaks to 5 min or less with water at each station in bottles, etc.

Then, divide your practice up into timed, scripted 5 minute segments to stay on point and make sure the starters and top backups get their reps in first. Avoid long sermons on technique.

You can really pack a lot of practice into 2.5 hours if you do it right.

Use longer 3 hour periods in the summer to explain and teach your drills (start with a slow walkthrough, then a 50% rep for everyone, then a full speed rep) and name each one, so when you call out "board drill" or whatever the players know what to do and how to do it so you're not wasting time explaining each one or herding them into position.

Even if it means doing fewer drills per day at first (and still only spending 3 hours, total, during a single practice) and spending longer at each one, you still invest the time early and work up to the fast paced practices you'll need. This is also the time to make sure your younger guys are getting plenty of reps and learning the game.

[flyinghelmet]

We only do them because the state mandates heat conditioning practice in just shorts, shirts, and helmets. Otherwise, I don't think we would do them anymore.

[coachd5085]

Jul 25, 2014 21:08:10 GMT -6 coachsant said:

to me 2 a days are necessary---you need to be doing the fundamentals for each position on o and d each day during camp---for a month---then when the season starts you get them once a week--if you dont do 2 a days I do not think you will be able to do this daily---unless you extend the one practice by an hour or 2--isnt that the same thing though?  

Coach you have to realize not everyone has the same situation.  Some coaches have been practicing 3-4 hours a day all summer, other coaches don't have a "month" before the start of football practice and game week set up.

[33coach]

I wonder if 2 a days were ever beneficial... I went through them as a player..not sure if they made me any better then 1 3 hour practice would....

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[fantom]

Jul 26, 2014 18:48:53 GMT -6 33coach said:

I wonder if 2 a days were ever beneficial... I went through them as a player..not sure if they made me any better then 1 3 hour practice would....

Sent from my VS980 4G using proboards

We do two 2.5 hour practices. Since 5 is more than 3 I think it's beneficial. 

[33coach]

Jul 26, 2014 19:10:23 GMT -6 fantom said:

Jul 26, 2014 18:48:53 GMT -6 33coach said:

I wonder if 2 a days were ever beneficial... I went through them as a player..not sure if they made me any better then 1 3 hour practice would....

Sent from my VS980 4G using proboards

We do two 2.5 hour practices. Since 5 is more than 3 I think it's beneficial. 

There is a point where too much training/knowledge is not beneficial

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[coachhewko]

Jul 26, 2014 10:00:46 GMT -6 @coacharnold said:

Jul 26, 2014 8:40:54 GMT -6 coachsant said:

we have players go both ways as I think most high schools do....I am very big on doing the same things drill wise/fundamentals every day over and over again.  That month during camp is essential to me.  You get both o and d skills every single day.  If you can do that without 2 a days I would like to know how?  Other than making one practice super long--plus there is also some brotherhood built amongst the coaching staff and players during 2 a days.  Most kids eat together in between sessions and the same with the coaching staff.   Nothing feels better than walking off the field after a nice long 2 a day !!!

So do you specialize and do one day of offense and only one day of defense during the season with no work whatsoever on the other side of the ball?

It's possible to train those skills by breaking down what you really need to get done, then devoting at least 30 min. per day to individual or group drills on each side of the ball (do 30 min. of fundamental offense on a defensive day; 30 min of tackling, pursuit, and defensive basics on a defensive day, etc.), as well as 20 min. to special teams. Have your scout team put together beforehand, drills set up during warmup, etc.

The other 70-100 min of a 2-2.5 hour practice can be spent however you need without making practice "super long." Use football specific things like pursuit drills, kickoff coverage drills, punt coverage, catch and score from 40 yards out,, etc. to build in the conditioning so you don't need to waste time having them run. Keep your water breaks to 5 min or less with water at each station in bottles, etc.

Then, divide your practice up into timed, scripted 5 minute segments to stay on point and make sure the starters and top backups get their reps in first. Avoid long sermons on technique.

You can really pack a lot of practice into 2.5 hours if you do it right.

Use longer 3 hour periods in the summer to explain and teach your drills (start with a slow walkthrough, then a 50% rep for everyone, then a full speed rep) and name each one, so when you call out "board drill" or whatever the players know what to do and how to do it so you're not wasting time explaining each one or herding them into position.

Even if it means doing fewer drills per day at first (and still only spending 3 hours, total, during a single practice) and spending longer at each one, you still invest the time early and work up to the fast paced practices you'll need. This is also the time to make sure your younger guys are getting plenty of reps and learning the game.

write your  typical practice schedule for a day during camp--one session

[fantom]

Jul 26, 2014 20:07:07 GMT -6 33coach said:

Jul 26, 2014 19:10:23 GMT -6 fantom said:

We do two 2.5 hour practices. Since 5 is more than 3 I think it's beneficial. 

There is a point where too much training/knowledge is not beneficial

Sent from my VS980 4G using proboards

True but we haven't found that this is the point. There's a pretty wide separation between practices: 8-10:30 and 5-7:30 so there's plenty of time to rest.