How do you go from being a bad coach to a good coach?

[bluedevil58]

I'm doing a lot of soul searching these days about my future in this profession.

I've been coaching 5 years, the last 3 at the varsity level.  I've never had a lot of responsibility beyond position coach but I study everything I can and try my best to get better and learn as much about the game as I can because I want to be a HC someday.  Last year I coached DL on one of the worst defenses in our entire state--we gave up 42 ppg.  A lot of people have blamed the guys I coached for our struggles as a defense last year and said they were why our defense sucked.  People, including our players, ask me all the time if I even played football in HS, or they are surprised to find out that I did.  I wasn't great, but I've loved the game ever since I first strapped on pads at 14.

We've had a lot of changes on our staff this year.  I've now taken over the OL and DL.  We had our first scrimmage today and were awful on OL (DL actually looked really good in our new system, but another guy helped coach them for 2 days so I can't take credit for that) and now everyone is pointing fingers at my linemen as the weak link on the team that's going to kill our whole season again and ruin things for a very talented group of athletes.  I've never coached OL before and barely played it in HS, but our previous OL coach had to retire right before the season due to health problems and I was the only one who was willing to take over.  Our new offense seems really complicated for the OL, but it's proven to work: our HC had the last .500+ records at this school when he ran it here in the early 2000s and thinks it's very simple.

Despite all the work I put into becoming better, to any objective observer it would appear that I'm still just a lousy coach.  We have some big, strong kids, but they aren't blocking anybody and I don't know what more I can do to make them better.  Very little of the stuff I've studied fits with what we're trying to do.  A veteran coach here tells me that I should "just have them fire off onto the guy on them and hold for a count of 3" but then we're mostly running traps (9 different ones) and sweeps (4 different ones with different guys pulling) so that doesn't fit exactly, plus we don't have a base pass protection so I don't know how to teach them the technique or rules for pass blocking.  I put them through trap drill every day and they still screw it up royally when we go vs. another team.

We now have the most talent this school's had in over a decade, as well as the same proven HC who got them to winning seasons then, but our success all rests on my shoulders as the OL coach.  If the position I coach sucks, all that talent is wasted.  How does someone go from being the weakest link on the staff to being an asset to his team? What more do I have to do to learn this game and get our kids playing right?  How long does it take to get competent when you're constantly working at it yourself but not seeing improvement from your players?

[coachguy83]

Coach the first thing that is going to help you because a good coach is some confidence. Your HC obviously believes in you enough to put you in charge of the most important group of guys on the field. That being said you need to talk with him to make sure you are on the same page. You said most of what you have studied does not apply to what you are trying to do. Talk to your HC and see if there is anything he recommends that you study to have a better grasp of his system.

The next thing that I reccomend to make you a better offensive line coach is to stop looking at the big picture of the offense. Offensive line play more than any other position on the field is all about the little things. Look at the skills that your players are going to need to be successful in your system and find drills to make them experts at those skills.

Lastly do not give up hope. Keep working your tail off to be the best coach you can be, because the good ones are few and far between.

[NC1974]

I echo many of the things that were already said and would add:

-the best ol coached I have seen know the offense inside and out. That may mean getting with your HC and/or OC and making sure you guys are on the same page
-good Ol coaches have an answer for every look you'll see. That means having blocking rules and knowing how they relate to every front or stunt you'll see
-good ol coaches embrace the fundamentals i,e every day drills
-every block you teach should specify first step, hand placement, hat placement, aiming point, leverage etc
-always coach finish and playing through the whistle
-have something that makes the guys believe in you, this is usually passion and expertise, guys will buy in if they see that they knwo what you are talking about

I guess that last thing I'll say is that should all stem from the head coach. The HC should teach the offese to the ac's nd should expect specific every day drills and teaching progressions

[rbcrusaders]

what do you actually have them do in practice? what are the exact drills and things that you stress?

[bluedevil58]

He didn't put me on OL because he had faith in me. He put me on OL because nobody else wanted to do it. He told me today after the scrimmage how pi$$ed off he was at our OL and me for not getting the job done.

I go over this stuff with him every day in practice making sure we're on the same page. He doesn't really care much about the OL or their rules as long as they fire out and block everybody so his backs can look good. I've looked up blocking rules and techniques other people use to teach these same plays and asked him if they were OK and he said they were.

I feel like we've got too many plays in for me to even practice. Our starters don't remember them. But it's a proven system. I just know that if it doesn't work, it's on me. You can't hide a bad OL.

So what does a coach need to do to get better? How do you become a good OL coach? I'm starting to hate coaching OL and coaching in general now.

[bluedevil58]

Aug 9, 2014 2:18:12 GMT -6 rbcrusaders said:

what do you actually have them do in practice? what are the exact drills and things that you stress?

Well, right now I get about 45 minutes of individual time with them a day, twice a week.

We have every day drills that eat up about 30 minutes of this.  The HC wants them starting off with a bunch of bag drills for agility.  Then he has us rep 1st and 2nd steps going both ways on air.  Then he wants us going to the sled and drive that.  That takes about 20 minutes altogether if we really hustle.  Then they get a 5 minute water break.  He also wants some King of Boards in there every day for about 5 minutes or longer.

I try to work a trap drill, some reach blocking drills, some mirror drills for pass blocking, and a 1-on-1 pass blocking drill where the DL gets 1 move to rush the QB and the OL has to protect an assigned gap at least once a week.

Then we're out of time and we go to team.  I'd like to do some blitz pickup with the RBs, some 2 on 2 and 3 on 3 drills, some downblocking drills, some scoop drills, etc. but I just don't have the time (or the RBs) to do that stuff.

Yesterday I spent 30 minutes on trap drill to try to straighten out problems we were having before our scrimmage, since we have 9 different traps installed (a little over half our running game) and we STILL made the same mistakes in our scrimmage today.  Everyone kept blocking the guy we were supposed to be trapping or forgetting which G was supposed to pull.  They also weren't getting in the right stances for the formation and our pass blocking was awful.

[rbcrusaders]

you need to focus more time on working fundamentals in indy I think. if you aren't doing the very basic techniques over and over, you need to start. doing agility drills etc is great, but you can't spend THAT much time,

work the things that are important. start, stance, firing out low, the proper fit and form, chopping feet, getting their face mask in the chest and grabbing shoulder pad chest plates, etc.

drill fundamentals. FUN DA MENTALS. over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over

[realdawg]

I would scrap the bag drills. Use it for more fundamental work. Make sure their feet are not dead. Our OL looked great all summer on shields but as soon as we could hit they werent near as good against men, so do alot of your drills against a live defender.

[blb]

Teach them WHO to block first, then HOW.

In explanation of your 45 minute Individual period you did not mention teaching rules-assignments or blocking defenses.

All you're doing is drills, some of which don't seem to apply to Offense you're running. And I can think of no bigger waste of time for OL than Agility bag drills.

No wonder your kids don't execute when you get to Team.

[coachfloyd]

Aug 9, 2014 5:15:15 GMT -6 blb said:

Teach them WHO to block first, then HOW.

In explanation of your 45 minute Individual period you did not mention teaching rules-assignments or blocking defenses.

All you're doing is drills, some of which don't seem to apply to Offense you're running. And I can think of no bigger waste of time for OL than Agility bag drills.

No wonder your kids don't execute when you get to Team.

This is it. Fundamentals don't mean crap if you don't know who to block. A bad block on the right guy is more valuable than a fundamentally sound block on the wrong dude. Spend time with them after practice and pre practice. Make sure you film team and watch it with them. All that bull crap he makes you do during Indy doesn't mean anything if they are confused. Offensive linemen will not play fast if they are confused. Draw the plays, walk through the plays, and rep them on bags. Knowing what to do is the most important thing.
Also it's only August 9th. There's going to be growing pains or else there would be no reason for practice.

[CS]

First thing I noticed was how complicated YOU were making it. I have never seen 9 different traps for an offensive line. For them it's pretty much the same blocking scheme no matter what the backfield is doing. It honestly comes down to either short trap or long trap

They don't need to see the big picture. Make it easier for them IMO

[fantom]

Aug 9, 2014 5:15:15 GMT -6 blb said:

Teach them WHO to block first, then HOW.

In explanation of your 45 minute Individual period you did not mention teaching rules-assignments or blocking defenses.

All you're doing is drills, some of which don't seem to apply to Offense you're running. And I can think of no bigger waste of time for OL than Agility bag drills.

No wonder your kids don't execute when you get to Team.

We haven't had the OL do agility bag drills in practice in over 20 years. Waste of time. 

[coachd5085]

Aug 9, 2014 2:51:29 GMT -6 bluedevil58 said:

He didn't put me on OL because he had faith in me. He put me on OL because nobody else wanted to do it. He told me today after the scrimmage how pi$$ed off he was at our OL and me for not getting the job done.

I go over this stuff with him every day in practice making sure we're on the same page. He doesn't really care much about the OL or their rules as long as they fire out and block everybody so his backs can look good. I've looked up blocking rules and techniques other people use to teach these same plays and asked him if they were OK and he said they were.

I feel like we've got too many plays in for me to even practice. Our starters don't remember them. But it's a proven system. I just know that if it doesn't work, it's on me. You can't hide a bad OL.

So what does a coach need to do to get better? How do you become a good OL coach? I'm starting to hate coaching OL and coaching in general now.

To become a better coach, you need to work with better coaches, and learn from other coaches. 

Your current HC is not a better coach if what you say here is true. 

[dbeck84]

I'm not familiar with the guy, but it sounds to me like you're giving the HC too much credit. If he's been running this same offense since the early 2000's but doesn't know/care about OL blocking rules and techniques, he isn't much of a coach. He needs to be able to give you what you need for your position group to be successful.

[larrymoe]

Aug 9, 2014 2:51:29 GMT -6 bluedevil58 said:

He didn't put me on OL because he had faith in me. He put me on OL because nobody else wanted to do it. He told me today after the scrimmage how pi$$ed off he was at our OL and me for not getting the job done.

I go over this stuff with him every day in practice making sure we're on the same page. He doesn't really care much about the OL or their rules as long as they fire out and block everybody so his backs can look good. I've looked up blocking rules and techniques other people use to teach these same plays and asked him if they were OK and he said they were.

I feel like we've got too many plays in for me to even practice. Our starters don't remember them. But it's a proven system. I just know that if it doesn't work, it's on me. You can't hide a bad OL.

So what does a coach need to do to get better? How do you become a good OL coach? I'm starting to hate coaching OL and coaching in general now.

I know this won't help you and that's what we're trying to do here, but if he, as OC, doesn't care about the OL or what they do, he isn't a very good OC or HC.  I don't care what his record may say.  

You can't be a good offensive coach if you don't know what your linemen are doing or are supposed to do.

[brophy]

Post some film

[larrymoe]

That being said, I agree you seem to be making this too complicated on yourself to begin with. If you think it's really too complicated it will come through to the kids and they'll think the same. Find a way to make it easier for yourself and your kids first and foremost. We run a lot of stuff that if you look at it in a certain way seems really complicated, but to our kids there's really only about 7-8 different blocking schemes altogether. I've designed our entire offense around making it simple for everyone, especially the OL, to remember their jobs.

If you have very wordy play calls, usually only the first couple words mean anything to the OL. Teach them there isn't a difference between Blue Trap Robber 789 and White Trap Bandit 732. They're both a 7 hole trap to them. Of course if that's applicable to your situation.

[powerfootball71]

I think coachs give way to much credit to fundimentel s , scheme , indy periods and drawing things up on a white borde. I've played or coached oline my whole life. I'm a 3rd generation coach . Have 4 alums from where I went to school with hc and oc experience in the pac 12 2 are currently nfl line coachs.

None of this means a damn thing to the kids.To me the whole secret to coaching oline is getting 5 guys to to have something special together and having those 5 guys to belive in me as a coach. Could be a lot of dumb bonding things outside football could be creating a us against them mentality threw the grind of practice. But getting those guys to love each other and play for each other is more important then ant drill I could run or play I could call.

So my advice is embrace the challenge there are resources to figure out what ever it is you need to figure out on a technical level but creating a culture is where it's at.

And I don't know if bag drills are good enuff for the seahawks there good enuff for me.

[freezeoption]

a good head coach will take time and help you in practice, if he has a position he needs to have a asst cover that position and he can go through with you that whole practice and do the drills and technique and scheme, a good head coach knows that his team will only go as far as his lineman will go, we are a new staff, not many assts I stopped drills with backs, gave it to a asst then went to line to get them through the chutes correctly cause yesterday they were on bodies and had been on air, after I got that going with the line coach I went back to backs, got a youngster there and it looked like he was having trouble, if your hc will not do this then if you can you might want to drop out of oline, say you will not coach it, of course you will probably b gone, but it sounds like to me he wants to have a scapegoat in his pocket, I have been in your sitch, but I have always used my rules, so when I was in a new system and the hc wouldn't give me rules, I had my own and adjusted those to the plays, it is hard to believe, but I have had several hc never give me rules, might give you a playbook, but even then some did not have rules, so it would be confusing as hell

[larrymoe]

Aug 9, 2014 9:40:58 GMT -6 powerfootball71 said:

I think coachs give way to much credit to fundimentel s , scheme , indy periods and drawing things up on a white borde. I've played or coached oline my whole life. I'm a 3rd generation coach . Have 4 alums from where I went to school with hc and oc experience in the pac 12 2 are currently nfl line coachs.

None of this means a damn thing to the kids.To me the whole secret to coaching oline is getting 5 guys to to have something special together and having those 5 guys to belive in me as a coach. Could be a lot of dumb bonding things outside football could be creating a us against them mentality threw the grind of practice. But getting those guys to love each other and play for each other is more important then ant drill I could run or play I could call.

So my advice is embrace the challenge there are resources to figure out what ever it is you need to figure out on a technical level but creating a culture is where it's at.

And I don't know if bag drills are good enuff for the seahawks there good enuff for me.

Agree with you on the drawing stuff on a board and scheme portions.  In my experience it's like trying to teach kids a subject they don't like or understand.  Only your true football junkies get off on that.  Hell, I'm a HC and I can't just sit there and listen to someone talk about scheme and draw stuff up on a board without getting bored.

Strongly, strongly disagree with the fundamentals portion.  Fundamentals are where you take your terrible, God awful O linemen and make them serviceable.  Your Pac 12 and NFL coaches may not feel that's necessary because they're dealing with physical freaks of nature that have already been taught fundamentals or don't need them because they're just that much more athletic.  They don't usually have to take some scrub and make him into your starting LT because for them a scrub is already in the top 10% of all the linemen in existence. 

[coachklee]

Aug 9, 2014 2:51:29 GMT -6 bluedevil58 said:

He didn't put me on OL because he had faith in me. He put me on OL because nobody else wanted to do it. He told me today after the scrimmage how pi$$ed off he was at our OL and me for not getting the job done.

I go over this stuff with him every day in practice making sure we're on the same page. He doesn't really care much about the OL or their rules as long as they fire out and block everybody so his backs can look good. I've looked up blocking rules and techniques other people use to teach these same plays and asked him if they were OK and he said they were.

I feel like we've got too many plays in for me to even practice. Our starters don't remember them. But it's a proven system. I just know that if it doesn't work, it's on me. You can't hide a bad OL.

So what does a coach need to do to get better? How do you become a good OL coach? I'm starting to hate coaching OL and coaching in general now.

I'm not even going to read the rest if the posts after reading this. The guy you are working for is a lousy HC! If it is a proven system it was in spite of this guy. Either his OL coach knew everything last time he won or the talent/strength was so much superior to some of the teams he beat that it didn't matter what happened up front.

Any good HC/OC would have very specific blocking rules whether it uses acronyms or a count or something. Any good HC/OC would be able to tell you "holy {censored}, they have no idea who to block" or "they are slow/high out of their stances" or "they don't sustain blocks long enough". Even more importantly that HC/OC would have specific drills or suggestions to fix it...maybe even come over & run OL group/drills a few days to help you.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[powerfootball71]

What I mean on fundimentel s is there not a cure all. I look at them as something that will make a bad player good and good player great. The big thing is its a skill you can coach. But if the player is not responsive to the coaching or they do not have a ingrained personal responsibility to apply them all I got is 5 guys that know how to be technically sound.

Have Seen you talk alot about wrestiling and one of the best things that really stuck with me was flying to Columbus with my friends dad his freshman year when he was trying to make Ohio states wrestiling team. This kid was going round after round going live with experienced varsity guys 2 to 3 weight classes above him getting the every living piss beat out of him.The dad said to a assistant guess his technique ain't up to par. The assistent says I don't give a damn about technique we can teach that I just want to know is he tuff and will he fight.

Fundimentel work I agree is the single most important thing we do but there are other things that must be established before they make a difference.

[fantom]

Aug 9, 2014 9:31:52 GMT -6 larrymoe said:

That being said, I agree you seem to be making this too complicated on yourself to begin with. If you think it's really too complicated it will come through to the kids and they'll think the same. Find a way to make it easier for yourself and your kids first and foremost. We run a lot of stuff that if you look at it in a certain way seems really complicated, but to our kids there's really only about 7-8 different blocking schemes altogether. I've designed our entire offense around making it simple for everyone, especially the OL, to remember their jobs.

If you have very wordy play calls, usually only the first couple words mean anything to the OL. Teach them there isn't a difference between Blue Trap Robber 789 and White Trap Bandit 732. They're both a 7 hole trap to them. Of course if that's applicable to your situation.

That's right. The OL only needs to know the blocking schemes and they need to know what to tune out. In our passing game we call the play with a three digit number. The first digit is the protection, the others are the pattern. I tell our guys that they only need to hear the first number. An example is: 426. If I ask a kid what the play is, he only says "4". Hell, I've been coaching in the system since 1988 and I don't know or care what "26" means. 

[coachbdud]

try to minimize what you do

tell the OC, look I cant teach all of this yet and be any good at it... tell him to pick just a top 4 and say that is all you are going to practice for now

work the skills and rules needed for those 4 plays and just rep them to death
class time
film time everything

that way theres no more hesitation... everything we do is zone/gap based so that we can just be aggressive and get off the ball... worst thing an OL can do it to hesitate

so limiting to just 4 schemes helps them mentally pick things up... and INDY wise you can focus on what you want to work on that day

we run IZ/OZ
power/counter

one day all of our drills and team are zone based
one day they are gap scheme based
then repeat

tell him he can do whatever he wants in the backfield... but your OL is only going to do 1 of those 4 schemes

i dont understand how you can have 9 types of trap

[coachbdud]

also narrow your focus down when watching

most beginning coaches (youre a beginner at OL ) watch the ball too often
focus on just your position

get an ipad or go pro or your regular camera or whatever
and have a kid film all of your team, inside run, blitz PU stuff and watch it
i know its hard seeing all 5 guys at once but doing this helps you to see the difference between when a kid just misses a block (itll happen)
or
-he doesnt understand the scheme
-technique breakdown

[dubber]

Aug 9, 2014 9:25:56 GMT -6 brophy said:

Post some film

If you really want some help from the board, do this.

[bluedevil58]

Aug 9, 2014 5:15:15 GMT -6 blb said:

Teach them WHO to block first, then HOW.

In explanation of your 45 minute Individual period you did not mention teaching rules-assignments or blocking defenses.

All you're doing is drills, some of which don't seem to apply to Offense you're running. And I can think of no bigger waste of time for OL than Agility bag drills.

No wonder your kids don't execute when you get to Team.

Those are the drills the HC said he wanted. That's the only reason I do all the bag drills and sled work or all the King of Boards. The HC said that's what we need to get them firing out.

I've used trap drill to teach them who to block there, but they still don't get it.

As for our system and why I think it's complicated, the whole thing is built around keeping it simple for the RBs and WRs. We use a route tree and number our backs and hole numbers like most people, then we have a word to tell the backfield action and play.

The OL needs to hear the formation to get their stance (we go 2 pt in shotgun and pistol sets), then they need to hear the hole number to know where it's going, then they need to hear the play name to know how to block it.

For example, we have 9 different traps:

41-42 Give, 41-42 Read, and 41-42 Trap are all the same for the OL.

Then 43-44 Give, 43-44 Read, and 43-44 Trap are the same as those: a short trap.

Then we have our long traps: 45-46 Give, 45-46 Read, and 45-46 Trap.

So those are our traps. The rest of our playbook is:

46 Toss-47 Toss(BSG pulls, playside reaches)
26 Jet-27 Jet (rip and run scheme)
26 Rocket-27 Laser (reach block scheme)
48-49 Quick Pitch (PSG pulls, everyone else reaches)
18-19 Speed Option (veer scheme)
43 Rocket-44 Laser (inside zone)
43-44 Dive (base blocking)
40 Direct (direct snap with wedge blocking)
26 Special (base blocking)

That's it so far. The kids need to know that if there's no word after the play, it's a pass. We will set up the pass protection that week or during the game. We have no base pass protections installed. I was told we'd be sliding them left or right, but then it seems like he really wants a BOB scheme. We also have some screens that pull linemen.

We will be adding more later, like a power, a counter trey, some reverses, etc. He also wants us to invert our Gs and Ts against even fronts. When I objected to that, saying it would be too much reteaching, he just said "if they can't learn it in a week, they don't need to be playing."

3 of our starters are special ed!

[fantom]

Aug 9, 2014 13:36:05 GMT -6 bluedevil58 said:

Aug 9, 2014 5:15:15 GMT -6 blb said:

Teach them WHO to block first, then HOW.

In explanation of your 45 minute Individual period you did not mention teaching rules-assignments or blocking defenses.

All you're doing is drills, some of which don't seem to apply to Offense you're running. And I can think of no bigger waste of time for OL than Agility bag drills.

No wonder your kids don't execute when you get to Team.

Those are the drills the HC said he wanted. That's the only reason I do all the bag drills and sled work.

I've used trap drill to teach them who to block there, but they still don't get it.

As for our system and why I think it's complicated, the whole thing is built around keeping it simple for the RBs and WRs. We use a route tree and number our backs and hole numbers like most people, then we have a word to tell the backfield action and play.

The OL needs to hear the formation to get their stance (we go 2 pt in shotgun and pistol sets), then they need to hear the hole number to know where it's going, then they need to hear the play name to know how to block it.

For example, we have 9 different traps:

41-42 Give, 41-42 Read, and 41-42 Trap are all the same for the OL.

Then 43-44 Give, 43-44 Read, and 43-44 Trap are the same as those: a short trap.

Then we have our long traps: 45-46 Give, 45-46 Read, and 45-46 Trap.

Unless I'm reading this wrong you may have 9 different trap plays but only two blocking schemes in each direction. 

[wolverine55]

Wow, I don't really know what to say after reading all that! At least there seems to be some carry over...if I was you now, the only thing I'd do is discuss the use of indy time with your HC. If he really wants all of that ran, you'll need all of your indy time to review scheme and just keep repping it and repping it and hope it sinks in with the players.

[bluedevil58]

Aug 9, 2014 13:45:29 GMT -6 fantom said:

Aug 9, 2014 13:36:05 GMT -6 bluedevil58 said:

Those are the drills the HC said he wanted. That's the only reason I do all the bag drills and sled work.

I've used trap drill to teach them who to block there, but they still don't get it.

As for our system and why I think it's complicated, the whole thing is built around keeping it simple for the RBs and WRs. We use a route tree and number our backs and hole numbers like most people, then we have a word to tell the backfield action and play.

Unless I'm reading this wrong you may have 9 different trap plays but only two blocking schemes in each direction. 

That's right but the different words and numbers confuse them.