Pro's and Con's of Youth Football

[wiaa3]

Hello Coaches,

I need some input from you about youth football (mainly 4th-6th grade full padded tackle).  What are the pro's and con's of having youth football?  I am looking for any and all opinions.  

Thank you.

[shocktroop34]

Give me a while and I'm sure I can come up with at least one 'Pro' to share...oh, I know...juice boxes and doughnuts after the game!  

That's all I got.  

I'm pretty down on youth football right now.  Which, to me, is sad because some of my fondest moments were the times I spent in youth football.  

Maybe it is the area that I now live in, but I have two kids under 10 that I will not let play.  In large part, due to the "showmanship" and lack of fundamental skill development by youth coaches.  

(This is not a bag on youth coaches overall, I just think I'm in a bad area for youth football)

[shocktroop34]

Also, I guess I'm old school in thinking that tackle should be reserved for 6th grade on up. I played padded flag until 5th. I learned many solid fundamentals.

6th, 7th, 8th, Pop Warner, and so on...

Just my opinion.

[biggus3]

I always like the matchup on o and d line in 6th grade, where one of the kids nuts have dropped way before everyone else. I think some kids get turned off to the sport by getting rag dolled every play until they catch up physically.

[coachrdc]

Oct 21, 2014 11:58:46 GMT -6 shocktroop34 said:

Also, I guess I'm old school in thinking that tackle should be reserved for 6th grade on up. I played padded flag until 5th. I learned many solid fundamentals.

6th, 7th, 8th, Pop Warner, and so on...

Just my opinion.

I agree.  I didn't start playing organized football until 6th grade.  I have been teaching Jr. high students at small schools for 3 years now, and I can't tell you how many kids I have talked to about playing football who say, "I've played since I was in first grade and I'm tired of it."  That is beyond sad to me.  Developmentally, it makes no sense, to me, for a 6 or 7 year old to run around with a helmet which is almost as big as they are.  They also have the attention span of a gnat (this doesn't always get better with time, ask my high school players) so trying to teach proper technique is darn near impossible.  Additionally, kids develop at such wildly different rates that the kids that are big and underdeveloped who turn into stud athletes by the time they are in high school are turned off because all they have done is play on the offensive line.  I, like shocktroop34, would prefer flag football until the 6th grade.  Let them run around and learn some ball skills and have fun.  I'm not vilifying programs that have contact at younger levels, my current one does, but I simply disagree with it.

[mahonz]

Long time youth Coach here.

The Pros and Cons pretty much mirror themselves at all levels IMHO. I have coached youth, HS, semi pro and pro indoor arena with youth being by far my first preference.

The biggest Con has to be the Program itself. It all starts there. There are poor Programs at every level to include the NFL. There are really good ones as well but at the youth levels its more of a crap shoot when you consider its run by Volunteers.

The biggest Pro has to be that football is the ultimate Team sport so there are many life lessons there for the younger kids.

We start em at Kindergarten. Purely developmental when they are that young. Anything we can do to keep them away from the everyone's a winner mentality that is sokker is a good thing.

[gibbs72]

Growing up: were were Flag from 4th - 6th grade. Tackle 7-8th grades. I liked that just because the younger/ elementary ages were more learning stance, basic football terms, putting on a helmet, etc. I have no problem saving tackling and more full contact for MS/ JH ages.

[resdeal]

I think youth sports eliminates the average players by the time they reach high school. The great football players that love the game will play it for as long as there are teams to play on. Every team has those not as good football players that need football more than it needs them (i love having these kids by the way). What most teams are lacking is the average player. The one that makes your special teams a little better, act as a good scout team player, or possibly become a starter by the time they are a senior. If you don't love the game of football, how long are you going to play it? If you start in 3rd grade you will have played for 6 season before you reach HIGH SCHOOL. I am a firm believer that great teams are full of average players. Almost everyone has great players (some more than others). Everyone has bad players.

[fballcoachg]

Oct 21, 2014 11:40:30 GMT -6 wiaa3 said:

Hello Coaches,

I need some input from you about youth football (mainly 4th-6th grade full padded tackle).  What are the pro's and con's of having youth football?  I am looking for any and all opinions.  

Thank you.

At that age there are absolutely no positives to fully padded tackle football. None, zero, zilch. For any of the perceived positives there are a mountain of negatives that run off far too many kids and turn off even more parents. Tackle football shouldn't start until 7th grade and even there it should be an opportunity for all kids to play not a pi$$ing contest in which keeping kids involved is sacrificed for "teaching them to win." There is no logical rationale for "youth" tackle, I have heard them all and none have held any water to this point.

while some will undoubtedly talk about poorly run programs at all levels it has been my experience and my collection of anecdotal evidence that detrimental programs and "coaches" are an epidemic at the pop warner level, not something I will ever run the risk off subjecting my kids to or want my football players to experience either...gotta play the odds and at that age they aren't in the favor of an average kid having a good experience and wanting to continue playing

[bluedevil4]

I'm not a fan of it. I'd rather have kids play flag or just not play at all until 7th grade. All they need to be learning at that age is how to play the game / fundamentals. The last thing you want for a high school program is potentially half of your youth players never coming out in high school because they were discouraged getting beat up by that one (or two) physically developed kids in youth ball. Not only that, but playing every year of youth ball, middle school, and high school can be quite exhausting I would imagine.

All our high school program asks of our middle school program is that they keep kids interested in playing football and use similar terminology (and teach proper fundamentals such as tackling).  We don't even care what schemes they run.  As long as the kids keep coming back when they're freshmen, we're happy.  We ask the same thing of our youth program, but the coaches down there don't always see things this way.

I remember a youth coach (basketball) told me once: "First thing you have to teach kids: Sports are not fair," and that if a kid is bad, he needs to learn right away that he needs to get out of the sport and find another niche for him. He takes these 4th and 5th graders and only puts the best five on the court and will only sub when he has kids that are "good enough." I guess he never heard the story of Michael Jordan. Unfortunately, I see a ton of this in youth football too, and it's just too sad for me.

Ages Birth to 5 years: No sports.  6-11/12 years: Learn basic fundamentals, terms, skills, etc. Start playing the full/complete sport competitively when you reach 12/13.

[coachd5085]

The "problem" (for lack of a better term) with your position bluedevil4 (and the others similar to it) is that it is answering the question from a certain perspective. That perspective seems to be : "the goal of youth football is to build a pipeline of players to service the Varsity High School program" as opposed to "the goal of youth football is to provide an opportunity for the youth to play football"

I have seen several mention the "less developed" players, but I would say the real gap exists precisely when many here are suggesting the players first start--Jr. High. Those are the age ranges where one athlete is shaving, and the next doesn't even have underarm hair. Those are the age ranges where the early-maturers start developing the hipsnap to really inflict punishment, particularly on those who have yet to really get deep into the maturation process.

[fantom]

I'm not crazy about youth sports in general. I just think that kids' lives are over-regulated today. Rather that playing in regular leagues and having practices organized and run by adults I'd rather see them playing pickup games, setting the games up themselves, solving their own problems, and having fun. The exception that I make is Little League baseball (as opposed to travel teams) and that's mainly because it's hard to get 18 kids together and find places to play.

[mrjvi]

We have flag football until 7th grade, then pads on the school team. We've been to states 3 times since I've been here. I don't believe you HAVE to have pop warner like everyone always tells me.

[coachrdc]

Oct 21, 2014 20:58:48 GMT -6 coachd5085 said:

I have seen several mention the "less developed" players, but I would say the real gap exists precisely when many here are suggesting the players first start--Jr. High. Those are the age ranges where one athlete is shaving, and the next doesn't even have underarm hair. Those are the age ranges where the early-maturers start developing the hipsnap to really inflict punishment, particularly on those who have yet to really get deep into the maturation process.

I hadn't really thought of it that way, though I would pose this question; does playing contact football at an age younger than Jr high give those "underdeveloped" players any chance to not get "punished"?

[tiger46]

Asking about youth football in a forum mainly frequented by HS coaches is going to give you a pretty skewed point of view and opinions about youth sports in general. Trying to gauge whether youth football is beneficial or harmful by asking a bunch of HS coaches is kind of futile.

I've been a youth football coach since 2005. I've coached players from 7yrs old to 13yrs old. I'm almost at the opposite end of the spectrum from fballcoachg- almost. There are definite cons to youth football. However, 'burn out' is not one of them. First of all, no youth coach or player owes any HS coach or HS football program j@cksh1t. If a kid decides he no longer wants to play by the time he reaches HS, so be it. That's his decision. That does not mean he was not taught properly or, that a good work ethic was not instilled in him. I'd prefer that my former players continue on to enjoy playing the sport after they leave our organization. However, that's just not ever going to be reality. I'd much rather that all of our players go on to have academic success than some short-lived HS gridiron glory. Unfortunately, that's not a reality, either.

I have players run the whole gamut when they reach HS. Some don't play. Some play but, they suck. Some are average players. Others become stars. Currently, two of my RB's from 2007 are starting varsity RB's at two different HS's. In contrast, I saw one of their teammates from 2007 - a stand-out WB/CB and straight 'A' student- walking down the sidewalk looking like a homeless bum. He had dropped out of school. It really saddened me. He was one of the boys that I was sure we had 'reached'. He had a jacked up homelife, to be sure. Another of their teammates also no longer plays. But, this past summer, he walked miles to and from work just to help supplement his family's meager income. He is a very good kid. I'd be proud if he were my son. I coach his younger brothers.

As for the argument about players size differences, that also doesn't hold much water. There's all sizes of youth & HS football players. League rules really come into play on that front at youth level. And, not every league is the same. Some players learn to deal with it. Others don't. For instance, I personally don't agree with older/lighter rules. That is because any youth coach with half a brain will choose a smaller, older experienced player over a larger younger player almost any day of the week.

I've also went to 7th grade games. I live across the street from one of the Jr. Highs. I am quite confident that we've coached several teams (11-12yr olds) that would beat the ever-living crap out of either of the teams on the field. I've also had teams (two seasons) that I think a few Sr. citizens with no pads or prior experience could have beaten in a pick up game.

As for development; I remember the father of one of the RB's I mentioned earlier telling me that his son didn't like football and was scared to get hit. He was partially correct. His son was scared to get hit. But, he loved football. He had just never been properly taught. It took us two seasons to develop him into a RB.

I also coach O-line. O-line and DB's are probably the two most over-looked, under-coached groups in youth football. I had six of the greatest youth O-linemen I could ever ask for last season. Three went on to play 7th grade football. Another moved away and plays on another team. I still have two left. All starters. I coached them for 4 years. They did things as a unit that I don't see 7th grade O-lines doing; including wedge, proper pass blocking, run blocking, understood blocking schemes, made calls at the LOS, pull, g block, cross block, pick up stunts & blitzes, cover wide splits, etc... None of this was because I'm some super coach. It was because I had them for 4yrs and gradually added in new skills as they became ready to learn them. More importantly, it is because we, as a coaching staff, care enough to go to football forums, buy books & DVD's, learn from other coaches at any level that is willing to share knowledge and convey as much as we can as best we can to our players.

[jrk5150]

Oct 21, 2014 19:50:05 GMT -6 bluedevil4 said:

 I guess he never heard the story of Michael Jordan.  

Apparently you didn't hear the story either.

I don't think there is a single varsity starter on our local HS team that didn't play youth football at some point.  Most of them started between 7-10 years old.  A couple of the lineman started in 7th grade because of weight limits leading up to that grade.  AND, not a single kid that started playing in 9th grade has made it to the starting line up, even as a senior.  I know of at least two kids in my son's class (currently a senior) who are STAR athletes in other sports, parents wouldn't let them play football until freshman year.  They were so far behind the youth football kids that they hung it up after their Soph years.  Personally I think that's a failure of the HS coaching staff to develop them, but that's another story.

I am also unaware of any kids in our local HS that were good youth players, or would have been good HS players, but left the sport due to their experience in youth ball.  Maybe there are some, but I don't know of them.  Some good players ultimately decided to specialize in other sports, but I believe that would have happened anyway.  And we lose some to the couch and video games (or drugs, or girls, or jobs, etc.).  Pretty sure that has nothing to do with youth football.

I can only speak from my own experience, and I freely acknowledge that it's just my OWN experience, and certainly not applicable to every one of the tens of thousands (or more) kids in youth football, and the thousands of HS football programs out there.  I don't believe my son would be the young man he is now if it wasn't for youth football.  I am 100% confident that he is a better human being because of youth football, and that flag football or any other sport wouldn't have done the same for him. More specifically to football, I don't think he'd be getting on the field as a Senior for a currently undefeated HS team if he hadn't started young.  It took him a long time to be comfortable out there, and the fact he could start when it was bobble head ball was perfect for him. I believe if he'd have waited until 10, 12, 14, he'd have ended up quitting.  But again - no way to know for sure, that's just what I believe, and it's just one kid.

As far as HS coaches - again, can only look at our town since that's what I know.  I know the local HS HC thinks the same as some of you, that kids shouldn't be in tackle until they're in middle school or even freshman.  Which is incredibly ironic given what I just pointed out above.  The guy doesn't even understand how his team came together.  Right now every one of his QB's was developed as a QB from 12 years old on by our youth program.  And they aren't "obvious" QB's; in my opinion, if they didn't show up as freshman knowing how to play the position, they probably wouldn't have been put into that position.  Of course, that's also, IMO, a bit of an indictment of the HS staff.

Let me add another thought - most studies I've seen about injuries clearly show that the older the kids, the more severe and frequent football injuries become.  The Mayo Clinic study is one that jumps to mind. I could EASILY make a very good argument that kids SHOULD play tackle football when they're young and unlikely to get hurt, and should NOT play it in HS where the injuries become more frequent and more severe.  So let's turn this around - what's the point of HS football?  Can't the kids just play flag in HS?  After all - I believe most studies around adolescent personality development will show you that kids are pretty well locked into who they are by the time they hit HS, so the most important period of development for them are the adolescent years.  Isn't that when it's most important to develop the character traits that football can bring to the table in a way that other sports can't?

[CS]

I would prefer the kids to play flag football until 6th grade simply because I think young kids get more out of it than they would with pads.

Defensively it's a great tool for teaching pursuit angles and getting to the ball. Also I just don't feel like the kids truly learn that much football until they mature more.

[jrk5150]

Oct 22, 2014 8:52:59 GMT -6 CS said:

I would prefer the kids to play flag football until 6th grade simply because I think young kids get more out of it than they would with pads.

Defensively it's a great tool for teaching pursuit angles and getting to the ball. Also I just don't feel like the kids truly learn that much football until they mature more.

I am not great at asking questions without seeming confrontational, so please bear that in mind - how much experience do you have with having nothing but kids who only play flag until 6th grade, and how they all ultimately develop as young men and HS football players?

I'm sure there are programs out there that do it this way and are successful, I'd just like to hear more about that.  I understand that what was good for my son may not be good for anyone else's...

Unfortunately, this thread probably has no real answers, because there's just no way to know how a different experience would impact individuals.  Even those programs that ARE successful going that direction - how could they know if they'd be more successful doing it differently?  It would be impossible to control the variables to measure different ways of doing it over time, which is the only true measure of whether one way is "better" than the other. Just the fact that the kids are different every year would provide enough variable to negate drawing real conclusions that aren't simply opinion.

I wonder if my son would be who he is if he only had flag until 12 years old...

Then again - I've seen the local NFL flag program - what a JOKE.  It's gym class.  I GUARANTEE that isn't doing a better job developing kids for tackle football in their future.  In fact, every kid I'm aware of that started in flag and moved to tackle quit tackle early on.  It's a different sport entirely.  I shudder at what our local football program would become if their only option is flag for those years.

[jrk5150]

In fact, if the only local option was the NFL flag football program, I would prefer the kids just play soccer until old enough to play football.  That flag program just RUINS kids for tackle.

[CanyonCoach]

We are moving to tackle in 3/4 grade due to the head injuries we had in flag at that age. I am intrigued by the padded flag idea never heard of that before.

[mahonz]

I coached a few seasons of 12/13 year old Winter Flag. I found it to be rather dangerous.

I have also coached a few seasons of 5/6 year old Spring Flag. I found it to be rather dangerous as well.

I have also coached numerous Adult Flag teams. Very aggressive in nature.

Im not sure everyone here fully appreciates the fact that "football" in all forms is a contact sport although I have never heard of padded flag. You'd almost have to coach Flag to appreciate the pitfalls...and the positives. Its most certainly not the answer some might think it is IMHO.

Plus Im not so sure the disdain some have for tackle football at the youth levels would be any different if it were flag, baseball, basketball or tiddly winks. Its still youth sports run by Volunteers. If the Volunteers don't "get it"....kids burn out...parents burn out. I have been a part of a few Orgs that were flat out pathetic....I have also been a part of a few Orgs that were absolute rock stars.

BTW...I dont coach kids with any hopes that they will play HS ball. I coach for the here and now. Half the kids I coach will most likely never be good enough to play at the next level so I give them all the best possible experience today. If they play on after Im done with them....great. If not...that's OK too. But all of them graduate up loving the game of football without question. We also do not have MS Sports here anymore...its youth straight into HS for all sports. Been that way for 20 years now.

Interesting Thread. Im curious what agenda the OP has? Create what is not there....kill off whats existing? Pipeline to the HS Program? His kids are old enough to play and are bugging him to death?

[fantom]

A question for HS coaches who believe that youth football's role is to prepare kids for HS football: Do you coach your team to prepare your kids for college ball?

[blb]

Oct 22, 2014 10:13:14 GMT -6 fantom said:

A question for HS coaches who believe that youth football's role is to prepare kids for HS football: Do you coach your team to prepare your kids for college ball?

That's not a complete comparison.

Youth and HS football take place in the same community, and most HS don't cut kids.

Colleges select the kids they take (recruit).

But to answer your question, no.

[gibbs72]

I view my role as a DC is to teach my players the best fundamentals I can and do put them in the best position possible to win every Friday night. As far as college goes, I think the best thing I can send a player to college with is solid fundamentals, good work ethic, and learning how to win. I see the role of a youth coach in relation to a HS coach being similar to mine for a college coach.

[CS]

Oct 22, 2014 8:57:43 GMT -6 jrk5150 said:

Oct 22, 2014 8:52:59 GMT -6 CS said:

I would prefer the kids to play flag football until 6th grade simply because I think young kids get more out of it than they would with pads.

Defensively it's a great tool for teaching pursuit angles and getting to the ball. Also I just don't feel like the kids truly learn that much football until they mature more.

I am not great at asking questions without seeming confrontational, so please bear that in mind - how much experience do you have with having nothing but kids who only play flag until 6th grade, and how they all ultimately develop as young men and HS football players?

I'm sure there are programs out there that do it this way and are successful, I'd just like to hear more about that.  I understand that what was good for my son may not be good for anyone else's...

Unfortunately, this thread probably has no real answers, because there's just no way to know how a different experience would impact individuals.  Even those programs that ARE successful going that direction - how could they know if they'd be more successful doing it differently?  It would be impossible to control the variables to measure different ways of doing it over time, which is the only true measure of whether one way is "better" than the other. Just the fact that the kids are different every year would provide enough variable to negate drawing real conclusions that aren't simply opinion.

I wonder if my son would be who he is if he only had flag until 12 years old...

Then again - I've seen the local NFL flag program - what a JOKE.  It's gym class.  I GUARANTEE that isn't doing a better job developing kids for tackle football in their future.  In fact, every kid I'm aware of that started in flag and moved to tackle quit tackle early on.  It's a different sport entirely.  I shudder at what our local football program would become if their only option is flag for those years.

Thats how my old school was. Worked out well for me and others as well as the program. The fact is there are more football teams than there are good youth coaches.

There is a team here that is coached by some kids that just got out of high school and I know them because they played under me. They should never coach anybody.  And this happens everywhere!!!

That being said looking back I had a very good 6th grade coach that taught us HOW to play and not to win necessarily. I'm not saying that some good can't come from youth football and I feel you are taking it that way, however, a lot of bad can come from bad coaches at the youth level and you don't see that as much with flag football. 

[hanagin]

I coach MS. I have coached HS. I have not coached a youth team.

We get a lot of kids who come out of the local youth programs. At least half, maybe as many as two-thirds, of our kids are youth players. The others fall into two general categories: kids who've played sports other than football and kids who've never played sports.

The youth players, for us, have a huge advantage in that they understand what we're talking about. They might not understand the intricacies of the triple option, but they at least understand what a guard does and which guy is the fullback, etc. We can teach all of them technique and fundamentals, with varying levels of success based on the individual kid's effort and athleticism. It's harder to often get the new kids to understand what's going on big picture. They don't seem to grasp the teamwork aspects quite as quickly (although they do get there eventually) and the general football IQ often isn't there (but, again, it will be in time).

Really, it's the athleticism that I like. I don't care what sport it is. Yeah, a kid who played soccer before will naturally shy from contact for a while, but you can break that habit in time. It's hard to take a kid who isn't used to physical exertion to go out there and to keep fighting to do his job even when he's tired and it isn't easy anymore.

Personally, I get a little annoyed when people bring up the youth football teams to me, whether it's the kids or their parents (who were often their former coaches). One of the kids will say, 'In Pop Warner, I used to be the _____." Or the parents will mention, "When I was coaching my son, we used to _____." That's annoying. Mostly, it's puberty that causes these problems (and parents as coaches who put their kids at the wrong position). We have to move a lot of the kids out of their Pop Warner positions because of where they are with puberty and where that puts them in relation to the team. But that's the same battle HS coaches have. It's easy for a kid to hit puberty early, be a MS stud, and then be later passed up by the others in HS.

They definitely also come with some bad habits to break, but that's about equal with the frustration of teaching a kid from a non-contact sport to seek out contact. And I'm sure the HS coaches probably think we give them bad habits in other areas that they end up having to break.

[jrk5150]

Oct 22, 2014 10:42:59 GMT -6 CS said:

Thats how my old school was. Worked out well for me and others as well as the program. The fact is there are more football teams than there are good youth coaches.

There is a team here that is coached by some kids that just got out of high school and I know them because they played under me. They should never coach anybody.  And this happens everywhere!!!

That being said looking back I had a very good 6th grade coach that taught us HOW to play and not to win necessarily. I'm not saying that some good can't come from youth football and I feel you are taking it that way, however, a lot of bad can come from bad coaches at the youth level and you don't see that as much with flag football. 

First, you are 100% accurate, there are a lot of bad youth coaches out there.  We have 5 teams in our program, and IMO two of them are coached poorly, but not so poorly that they run kids out of football.  We've had 1, maybe 2, of those coaches over my 11 years in our program, and we showed them the door.

Second - don't stop there.  There are more HS teams than good HS coaches as well.

And third - everything you said applies to HS as well.  A lot of bad can come from poor HS coaches.  Unfortunately, most kids don't play beyond HS, so their bad experience is their last experience.  At least there usually CAN be a "next year" for youth players.

[blb]

Full disclosure, I have never coached below HS varsity level.

I am ambivalent about youth football.

When I was growing up and the dinosaurs roamed the Earth, we didn't start tackle football until 8th grade. There was no Pop Warner or other in our area until later. I would've killed to start playing earlier.

Some believe that if we don't get kids started playing at an early age, some never will give it a try, because Soccer in particular starts them so young.

I see communities where youth program is closely aligned with HS, and it benefits the latter tremendously.

And of course there are successful HS programs that have no connection to youth teams or vice-versa at all.

One thing that may affect continued participation in HS: By the time kids get to 9th grade, they have had nice unis with names on back, played on HS field with scoreboard, PA, cheerleaders, the whole bit. Some have played in championship games with trophies and medals.

There's no special allure to playing HS football. They've been there, done that. Only thing we can offer them that's different is starting practice three weeks before school and year-round conditioning.

I also cringe when I observe youth coaches who coach their teams like boot camps - spend more time on calisthenics and conditioning than fundamentals and learning how to play the game. That's when some kids will learn football is not much fun and stop playing.

[jrk5150]

And just to be clear - while I AM bashing HS coaches, it's really just to make a larger point, which is that everything is relative.  Everything said about youth applies to HS as well.  How many college coaches have to undo bad habits learned in HS?  How many pro coaches have to undo bad habits learned in college?


HS isn't some magical place where everything suddenly matters, it's just another stop on the road to adulthood.  HS sports are no more or less important in the greater scheme of things than youth sports.  They may be remembered more vividly because the memories are created when kids are older, but the positives/negatives are pretty much the same.

For every HS coach shaking his head at a youth program, there's a youth coach shaking his head at a HS program who suddenly can't win with the same kids and against the same kids that the youth program won with every year up to then.  It's not like the kids in the other towns magically grow bigger and faster than our kids, or that the other towns have this big influx of talent that we don't have - simple fact is, you're getting outcoached.  I just wish more HS coaches would fess up to that.  Okay - I just wish more coaches at any level would fess up to that, since that's the only way you get better.  I will freely acknowledge youth coaches (incorrectly) blame players too.

[jrk5150]

Oct 22, 2014 11:04:05 GMT -6 blb said:

Full disclosure, I have never coached below HS varsity level.

I am ambivalent about youth football.

When I was growing up and the dinosaurs roamed the Earth, we didn't start tackle football until 8th grade. There was no Pop Warner or other in our area until later. I would've killed to start playing earlier.

Some believe that if we don't get kids started playing at an early age, some never will give it a try, because Soccer in particular starts them so young.

I see communities where youth program is closely aligned with HS, and it benefits the latter tremendously.

And of course there are successful HS programs that have no connection to youth teams or vice-versa at all.

One thing that may affect continued participation in HS: By the time kids get to 9th grade, they have had nice unis with names on back, played on HS field with scoreboard, PA, cheerleaders, the whole bit. Some have played in championship games with trophies and medals.

There's no special allure to playing HS football. They've been there, done that. Only thing we can offer them that's different is starting practice three weeks before school and year-round conditioning.

I also cring when I observe youth coaches who coach their teams like boot camps - spend more time on calisthenics and conditioning than fundamentals and learning how to play the game. That's when some kids will learn football is not much fun and stop playing.

Agreed with your last point about youth coaches.  I HATE when I see youth teams running laps or engaging in these long stretching regimens, shows me they aren't doing their homework keeping up with modern methods.

I didn't play until 9th grade, even though there was a local youth program.  And I started on varsity in 10th grade.  So it's not like my personal experience mirrors my current opinion.  In fact, I was adamantly against my son playing at 7, he and my wife did it behind my back.  I was really worried that he'd take a big hit and not be mature enough to understand it in context, and be done with football forever.  Basically, what some of the coaches on here appear to be afraid of.  And yet, the actual experience was 180* different.  I am now a forever believer in what tackle football can do for kids, at least from 7 years old and up (still on the fence about the 5-6's).  Fact is, tackle football is hard, and is a lot harder than anything else most of those kids have ever done.  There's value in that, especially as our society is trying to make things easier.  You can't make football easier unless you go to flag.  I feel like wrestling (never participated but grew up in a huge wrestling area) and football are the last bastions of "difficult" for kids, and there are tremendous life lessons in participating in something that is inherently difficult but in a way that you can get through if you just put out the effort.