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Post by tog on Jul 13, 2021 22:48:42 GMT -6
 this dumb tweet got me thinking like an all time gm---a ton of those dudes wouldn't be on my list, especially at those prices lol and ol? and defense? make your own all time top 22 and hell add a kicker or two in there why not let's have some fun |
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Post by coachscdub on Jul 13, 2021 23:15:22 GMT -6
Brady - Tomlinson - Moss - Hopkins - Gronk
Punter - Shane Lechler
Kicker - Sebastian Janokowski
Defense - Probably the Ravens with Suggs Lewis and Reed
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Post by tog on Jul 14, 2021 0:05:06 GMT -6
total value spread out all over the team, this is a great exercise, not just picking an all time team yo
my big money is going to earl and the ol and the defense as you will see
qb---kenny stabler--value/winner/tough as nails
tb-earl---yeah, I pay the extra here
fb- jerry ball---unorthodox pick here--but cheap, huge fullback at smu that got moved to dl---tog keep at 290lb fb
te-bavaro--not as flashy as some--value there
lt-art shell I know they are higher value
lg-gene upshaw---but I want the raider pair
c-dave rimington---should be cheap compared to the rest of the hall of famers
rg---john hannah---yeah I am paying the premium here
rt-brian blados---value behemoth before the pace's of the world
wr-crazy legs hirsch---deep ball guy--cheap, most will pick modern diva types
wr-hines ward--great blocker, competitor my kinda player---plus can use for other things
DEFENSE
going with 3-4 here for value how I see it
dt---Elvin Bethea---my tnt is just 3 tough space eater dudes that will stop the run, cheap, andre and lt will get to the qb
ng ---fred smerlas
dt---Curley Culp
olb--andre tippet--spending money here
olb--lt--spending my most money here besides maybe earl
ilb--steve nelson--warrior patriot guy--value pick
ilb---bednarik, just to kill the gifford types
ss---larry fulcher--huge hitter guy cheap
fs--jack tatum---yeah, I don't want anyone catching a ball in the deep without a threat---will pay extra for that
corner---lester hayes just so I can shake hands with him and the stickum on after games
corner---frank minnifield --just lock a guy up and do it cheap
punter? reggie roby
kicker? art dempsey
my team may not win every week
but will bludgeon the league into submission and hurt folks in the playoffs enough to win the whole thing
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Post by tog on Jul 14, 2021 0:07:03 GMT -6
Brady - Tomlinson - Moss - Hopkins - Gronk Punter - Shane Lechler Kicker - Sebastian Janokowski Defense - Probably the Ravens with Suggs Lewis and Reed need more than that to do this right lots of value in older players no one even knows about too...... |
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Post by coachscdub on Jul 14, 2021 0:57:04 GMT -6
Brady - Tomlinson - Moss - Hopkins - Gronk Punter - Shane Lechler Kicker - Sebastian Janokowski Defense - Probably the Ravens with Suggs Lewis and Reed need more than that to do this right lots of value in older players no one even knows about too...... Alright let me try once more QB - Tom Brady (My pick for best all time, controversial i know) RB - Ladanian Tomlinson (Player i grew up watching) WR1 - Randy Moss (Dominant WR, Commands a double team, great football IQ) WR2 - Terrell Owens (I mean it's TO, no more need be said) WR3 - Larry Fitzgerald (Tough pick here, but he's dependable, knowledgeable and can play in the Slot) TE1 - Gronkowski (Dynamic Hybrid, a Good blocker and WR, great for basing out of 11P) LT - Jonathen Ogden LG - Larry Allen C - Jim Otto RG - Gene Upshaw RT - Anthony Munoz Kicker - Sebastian Janokowski Punter - Ray Guy or Shane Lechler DE - Lawrence Taylor DT - Warren Sapp DT - Joe Green DE - JJ Watt MLB - Ray Lewis WLB - Patrick Willis CB - Nnamdi Asomugha CB - Darrelle Revis BS - Ed Reed FS - Charles Woodson Nickle - Tyrann Mathieu |
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Post by Down 'n Out on Jul 14, 2021 5:42:38 GMT -6
QB - Warren Moon (would look good running Waggle!)
FB - Jim Brown
RB - LaDainian Tomlinson
WB - Tiki Barber (maybe the best all around back in NFL history, he can do it all)
WR1 - Randy Moss
TE1 - Jason Witten (always open and a solid blocker)
LT - Randall McDaniel (I know he was a Guard but I think he'd make a fine Quick Tackle)
QG - John Hannah
C - Bruce Matthews
RG - Larry Allen
RT - Jonathan Ogden
Kicker - Adam Vinatieri
Punter - Shane Lechler
DE - Lawrence Taylor
DT - Warren Sapp
DT - John Randle
DE - Reggie White
MLB - Jack Lambert
WLB - Ray Lewis
CB - Deion Sanders
CB - Darrelle Revis
SS - Cam Chancellor
FS - Ronnie Lott
NB - Ed Reed
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Post by wingtol on Jul 14, 2021 6:00:30 GMT -6
I am still stuck on Marino for a buck. If Dan is letting it rip in todays NFL this cap hit could be the best value ever in the history of sports!!!!!!!
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Post by dubber on Jul 14, 2021 6:37:40 GMT -6
I am still stuck on Marino for a buck. If Dan is letting it rip in todays NFL this cap hit could be the best value ever in the history of sports!!!!!!! I unpopulary maintain he is the greatest QB of all time. I’m spending my money on OL/DL……anyone looks like hall of gamer running behind Pace, Munoz, Allen, Mawae, and Shaq Mason (could’ve gone several different ways on the last OG (ex. Grimm or Faneca), but I wanted to take a moment to highlight that Mason was the true MVP of super bowl 53) |
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Post by dubber on Jul 14, 2021 6:44:30 GMT -6
Also, give me Donald, Sapp, White, and Watt on the D line and 7 guys signed at the league minimum for the back 7….
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Post by wingtol on Jul 14, 2021 7:59:38 GMT -6
I am still stuck on Marino for a buck. If Dan is letting it rip in todays NFL this cap hit could be the best value ever in the history of sports!!!!!!! I unpopulary maintain he is the greatest QB of all time. I’m spending my money on OL/DL……anyone looks like hall of gamer running behind Pace, Munoz, Allen, Mawae, and Shaq Mason (could’ve gone several different ways on the last OG (ex. Grimm or Faneca), but I wanted to take a moment to highlight that Mason was the true MVP of super bowl 53) As a Western PA boy myself and life long Dolphins fan I agree 100% with your Marino take |
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Post by coachd5085 on Jul 14, 2021 9:02:25 GMT -6
I am still stuck on Marino for a buck. If Dan is letting it rip in todays NFL this cap hit could be the best value ever in the history of sports!!!!!!! Yeah, this set up wasn't very respectful with regards to the talent bands and cost differentials. No way that Brady is 5x Marino. Or Sanders 2 levels above Walter. This type of memes are popular online, but they don't utilize all time greats because that somewhat defeats the purpose. The use players with objectively different levels of success/acccomplishments/talents. For instance a current qb range might be Mahommes -- Josh Allen-- Lamar Jackson-- Ryan Tannehill-- Derek Carr. An all time QB range might be Brady-- Moon-- Kelly-- Namath... Or something like that. All time "buy your team" lists are much harder. |
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Post by larrymoe on Jul 14, 2021 10:00:51 GMT -6
These exercises generally just turn into "Show me what era of the NFL you grew up watching".
That being said, it's an exercise in futility to argue eras of the NFL. Some of the all time greats wouldn't be invited to camp in today's game and some, such as Namath, would be absolute monsters in today's rule changes.
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Post by coachwoodall on Jul 14, 2021 10:42:16 GMT -6
These exercises generally just turn into "Show me what era of the NFL you grew up watching". That being said, it's an exercise in futility to argue eras of the NFL. Some of the all time greats wouldn't be invited to camp in today's game and some, such as Namath, would be absolute monsters in today's rule changes. Yeah I tend to avoid these barber shop type of arguments.... and lo and behold there was one of these going on in the office when I walked in. Counting the number of straw man and circular arguments that get presented are the only thing that piques my interest. |
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Post by dubber on Jul 14, 2021 10:43:22 GMT -6
Don Hutson for a dollar is also crazy.
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Post by coachwoodall on Jul 14, 2021 10:44:53 GMT -6
I am still stuck on Marino for a buck. If Dan is letting it rip in todays NFL this cap hit could be the best value ever in the history of sports!!!!!!! I was thinking the same thing until Don Hutson's name came up at WR1 for a $1. The numbers he put in his era are mind boggling. |
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Post by larrymoe on Jul 14, 2021 10:46:38 GMT -6
Don Hutson for a dollar is also crazy. He is exactly who I was thinking about when I said some of the all time greats wouldn't get invited to camp. |
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Post by tog on Jul 14, 2021 11:08:08 GMT -6
These exercises generally just turn into "Show me what era of the NFL you grew up watching". That being said, it's an exercise in futility to argue eras of the NFL. Some of the all time greats wouldn't be invited to camp in today's game and some, such as Namath, would be absolute monsters in today's rule changes. Yeah I tend to avoid these barber shop type of arguments.... and lo and behold there was one of these going on in the office when I walked in. Counting the number of straw man and circular arguments that get presented are the only thing that piques my interest. true but I had fun coming up with my list last night |
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Post by dubber on Jul 14, 2021 11:31:03 GMT -6
DL is where I feel this conversation makes me giddy……I really believe 4 all time greats up there and you could get away with playing cover 2 with nfl minimum guys.
College guys talk all the time how the hardest cats to get are dominant DL guys, because of rarity and impact.
You can avoid throwing at Deion, but you have to account for a great DL every play, regardless of the play.
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Post by larrymoe on Jul 14, 2021 12:37:23 GMT -6
DL is where I feel this conversation makes me giddy……I really believe 4 all time greats up there and you could get away with playing cover 2 with nfl minimum guys. College guys talk all the time how the hardest cats to get are dominant DL guys, because of rarity and impact. You can avoid throwing at Deion, but you have to account for a great DL every play, regardless of the play. Agreed. You put a front 4 of Reggie White, John Randle, Warren Sapp and LT out there, you better have the greatest quick game ever. |
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Post by coachd5085 on Jul 14, 2021 12:46:50 GMT -6
DL is where I feel this conversation makes me giddy……I really believe 4 all time greats up there and you could get away with playing cover 2 with nfl minimum guys. College guys talk all the time how the hardest cats to get are dominant DL guys, because of rarity and impact. You can avoid throwing at Deion, but you have to account for a great DL every play, regardless of the play. When watching an NFL game vs any other level, I think it is pretty obvious that the play of the defensive front by far is has the biggest differential between levels. Next might be quarterback play in my opinion. |
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Post by Deleted on Jul 14, 2021 13:08:41 GMT -6
Manning, Payton, Rice, Jones, and Witten. $15.
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Post by tripsclosed on Jul 14, 2021 17:51:45 GMT -6
Also, give me Donald, Sapp, White, and Watt on the D line and 7 guys signed at the league minimum for the back 7…. Servicable CBs are a dime a dozen. See what I did there? 😄 |
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Post by dubber on Jul 14, 2021 18:40:17 GMT -6
Also, give me Donald, Sapp, White, and Watt on the D line and 7 guys signed at the league minimum for the back 7…. Servicable CBs are a dime a dozen. See what I did there? 😄 I would say yes. To be clear, with that dream front, I’m never playing 0. We would have the lowest blitz percentage in the league. The NFL is full of guys who can play soft cover 2 and keep everything in front of them, especially if we are only worried about routes that take less than 2.1 seconds to develop. |
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Post by carookie on Jul 14, 2021 20:52:58 GMT -6
I am still stuck on Marino for a buck. If Dan is letting it rip in todays NFL this cap hit could be the best value ever in the history of sports!!!!!!! Its the rings fallacy, the media hypes football up like an individual sport that is won by QBs. Ergo the QB with the most rings must be the best. At their peaks, the only QB I'd say that was better than Marino was Manning, yet they don't have the rings so the talking heads won't bring it up. |
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Post by tog on Jul 14, 2021 21:01:18 GMT -6
I am still stuck on Marino for a buck. If Dan is letting it rip in todays NFL this cap hit could be the best value ever in the history of sports!!!!!!! Its the rings fallacy, the media hypes football up like an individual sport that is won by QBs. Ergo the QB with the most rings must be the best. At their peaks, the only QB I'd say that was better than Marino was Manning, yet they don't have the rings so the talking heads won't bring it up. stabler, baugh, graham, unitas might have a thing or two to say about it too |
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Post by coachd5085 on Jul 14, 2021 21:14:10 GMT -6
Its the rings fallacy, the media hypes football up like an individual sport that is won by QBs. Ergo the QB with the most rings must be the best. At their peaks, the only QB I'd say that was better than Marino was Manning, yet they don't have the rings so the talking heads won't bring it up. stabler, baugh, graham, unitas might have a thing or two to say about it too I think you are over romanticizing some of those guys when it comes to the actual skill level of the quarterback position when compared to Marino, Manning etc. Lol. |
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Post by carookie on Jul 15, 2021 9:20:38 GMT -6
stabler, baugh, graham, unitas might have a thing or two to say about it too I think you are over romanticizing some of those guys when it comes to the actual skill level of the quarterback position when compared to Marino, Manning etc. Lol. Yeah, I think the athleticism and speed of the game (really post merger) is so much more that you have to give Marino and Manning the nod. That being written, those from the previous generation were basically serving as QB and play caller; so respect to them for greatness in what was a different task. |
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Post by coachd5085 on Jul 15, 2021 9:25:12 GMT -6
I think you are over romanticizing some of those guys when it comes to the actual skill level of the quarterback position when compared to Marino, Manning etc. Lol. Yeah, I think the athleticism and speed of the game (really post merger) is so much more that you have to give Marino and Manning the nod. That being written, those from the previous generation were basically serving as QB and play caller; so respect to them for greatness in what was a different task. Can't speak to Marino, but I think we all know that Manning also fits that bill as well. Because of the advances in athletic performance training as well as compensation allowing for hyperfocused careers. Stablers contract from Houston was estimated to be $450,000 ish in 1982 - Translated today to about $1.2 million. Nothing to sneeze at , but obviously not what QBs make today. All that said, I think 99% of this board is smart enough to know that you can't intelligently compare across generations. But you can absolutely do it passionately LOL! |
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Post by tog on Jul 15, 2021 14:56:22 GMT -6
stabler, baugh, graham, unitas might have a thing or two to say about it too I think you are over romanticizing some of those guys when it comes to the actual skill level of the quarterback position when compared to Marino, Manning etc. Lol. so the mechanics of three step, 5 step, 7 step drops have changed? and the arm strength for some reason is sooo much better? unitas has the best mechanics I have ever seen there aint no romanticize here, those dudes at THAT position could play in any era |
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Post by larrymoe on Jul 15, 2021 16:06:27 GMT -6
Unitas almost didn't make it in his era.
As far as today? I imagine his scouting report would say- Too short. Long looping arm motion. Carries football too low when setting up. Most successful off play action. Slow footed. Strong arm with good accuracy.
His intelligence was also questioned 70 years ago. That could be a real problem in today's era.
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